Lesson 90
Intermediate
Intermediate
We Only Kissed
Today, turn down the lights, spray some perfume, and light the candles. We're getting cooperative with the -iş suffıx.
Psst! Want to access
everything in this lesson?
everything in this lesson?
Justin
Merhaba Martha!
Good question.
First, you're right. There is a difference here between the original sentence (Ben ailemle. . .) that did not use a cooperative verb and the one you saw in the dialog - which does use a cooperative verb.
So, to answer both of your questions at once:
Cooperative verbs can encompass their indirect object, but they don't have to. In non-grammar nerd terms, the way you conjugate a cooperative verb can include the person you are doing the action with, or not. It's optional. There's no difference. So, you *can* have buluştum. For example,
Dün Ferit'le buluştum.
I met with Ferit yesterday.
. . . means the same things as,
Dün Ferit'le buluştuk.
Ferit and I, we met yesterday.
You probably notice the ambiguity in this last sentence. It can also mean,
Dün Ferit'le buluştuk.
We met with Ferit yesterday.
You have to pull the meaning from the context.
Does that clear everything up?
Good question.
First, you're right. There is a difference here between the original sentence (Ben ailemle. . .) that did not use a cooperative verb and the one you saw in the dialog - which does use a cooperative verb.
So, to answer both of your questions at once:
Cooperative verbs can encompass their indirect object, but they don't have to. In non-grammar nerd terms, the way you conjugate a cooperative verb can include the person you are doing the action with, or not. It's optional. There's no difference. So, you *can* have buluştum. For example,
Dün Ferit'le buluştum.
I met with Ferit yesterday.
. . . means the same things as,
Dün Ferit'le buluştuk.
Ferit and I, we met yesterday.
You probably notice the ambiguity in this last sentence. It can also mean,
Dün Ferit'le buluştuk.
We met with Ferit yesterday.
You have to pull the meaning from the context.
Does that clear everything up?
Martha
Evet, anladım. However, I just did the lesson on -esi and came across this sentence in the Dialog:
Süleyman’la kavga ettik dün gece.
It is translated in the Dialog as "Süleyman and I fought last night," even though the "we" form of the verb is used. Is this because "kavga etmek," when used with "la," is sort of like a cooperative verb? Whereas "gitmek," which I used in that original sentence of mine, could never carry a cooperative meaning? Or is the sultan just using the "royal we"? ;)
Teşekkürler!
Süleyman’la kavga ettik dün gece.
It is translated in the Dialog as "Süleyman and I fought last night," even though the "we" form of the verb is used. Is this because "kavga etmek," when used with "la," is sort of like a cooperative verb? Whereas "gitmek," which I used in that original sentence of mine, could never carry a cooperative meaning? Or is the sultan just using the "royal we"? ;)
Teşekkürler!
Justin
You nailed it - kavga etmek carries a cooperative meaning. You can't really fight in one direction - it has to be a mutual action.
So, this sentence is ambiguous. It can mean both, "We fought with Suleyman" and "Suleyman and I fought." Like the example with Ferit above.
So, this sentence is ambiguous. It can mean both, "We fought with Suleyman" and "Suleyman and I fought." Like the example with Ferit above.
Justin said, "Merhaba Martha, I double-checked with Büşra - "Ben ailemle Istanbul'a gittik" is not okay. If you ever see it in the wild, shoot us an email. It very well might have been a typo (hopefully not on our site!)"
But now I think that I was confused and must have been thinking of a sentence that used a cooperative verb. Because I now I see this sentence in the Dialog:
Dün Ferit’le buluştuk.
The "ben" seems to be implied in this sentence, yes? "Buluştuk" would really mean "we met each other," but then you have "Ferit'le." Can you talk a little bit about this construction?
And please forgive the obvious thought, but I guess this also means that cooperative verbs, just by their nature, always take a plural ending? There is no such thing as "buluştum," right? It just wouldn't make sense.
Teşekkürler!